Mochashosh
member
Reged: 16/02/2009
Posts: 276
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Hello everyone
Had a lovely walk in the park with Mags and Clery today, and have just been dancing, so feel well exercised.
A problem has come up at one of the evening classes I teach. It's been around for some time but it's getting worse.
One of the students in another teacher's class has a very bad smell. It's not BO, but more like urine, or possibly floor varnish, and it is getting stronger. I don't think he is very well, so it may be a side-effect of medication, but some of the teachers really have trouble having him in the room, and nobody will sit next to him. One of the teachers was nearly ill from being in the same room.
He is a real sweetie, and one doesn't like to say these things because he may have no control over it, and because it's not a nice thing to say, and his feelings would be so hurt, but it is becoming very difficult, and nobody quite knows what to do.
Has anyone dealt with this kind of problem before? What happened?
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PLASMO
member
Reged: 13/03/2008
Posts: 13091
Loc: FLOUNCELAND
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Hi Mochaschosh,
What a dilemma.
Many years ago, in the building where I was a PA, we had a lovely cleaner, she was such a nice person, everyone liked her, she was part of our team.
My Boss called me in one day, and said to me " We need to something about the cleaner", I was slightly taken aback, and said "What do you mean"? he said, that he found her body odour most offensive, and he had been told my many visitors to our building, who had also been aware of her problem. I must admit I had also been aware of it for some time.
To cut a long story short, he insisted that I was to tell her. It was a very awkward moment for me, as I didnt want to make her feel too embarrassed or uncomfortable, so I basically told her in a gentle fashion, that we had had some complaints about her body odour. She took it extremely well I thought, but I did not feel good at all, at having to do, what I thought, was someone else's job. After all I was only the PA, not the Personnel Officer.
I think in your case, I would not like to be in your shoes, but I believe you have to tell the truth, in whatever way, you think will hurt him the least.
Plasmo x
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andfletch
member
Reged: 01/11/2009
Posts: 14
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Gosh these things are so difficult. It absolutely needs to be dealt with - because it will start impacting the other students and even possibly their attendance. But how to deal with it without offending or embarrassing the poor person. Is there an overall controller at the night classes? I think there will need to be 2 people with him to cover this - in case of an adverse reaction. Maybe then his teacher and this 'controller' could book a time with him just to have a chat and perhaps ask if he's well, going through anything because .... there is this problem. And what can they do to help him to sort it out. Maybe if it's approached as a collaborative thing as opposed to a "you sort this out" thing he may be a bit more forthcoming.
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CAZ50
member
Reged: 10/07/2008
Posts: 1523
Loc: Up the creek without a paddle
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I agree with Plasmo on this one. He has to be told, but in a sensitive nice way, if that's possible. He may well be aware of it himself, you never know. Just think you may be doing him a favour in the long run.
I once worked in an office with a french girl who had a bad odour problem. She was a beautiful girl, and wore very expensive clothes, the trouble was she never seemed to wash them frequently enough. She was told about the problem and was a little upset at first, but she never smelt of B.O. again so it was worth it.
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I don't suffer from insanity I enjoy every minute of it!!
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Mochashosh
member
Reged: 16/02/2009
Posts: 276
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Maybe I will have a chat with the Director of Education about it and see if she has any ideas. She is a straight-talking Ozzie though, and she might just come right out with it.
I was thinking of having a chat with him about his health, and if he said things weren't too good, getting him an appointment at the complementary polyclinic, where they might be able to suggest something that would help his general well-being, and also with whatever the underlying problem may be.
Beyond that, I'm really running out of ideas, but so many people are now commenting on it that I fear we might have to speak about it in some way. I just wish I knew how.
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andfletch
member
Reged: 01/11/2009
Posts: 14
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Well she may be a straight talking Aussie, but this is a very sensitive topic and if you approach it that way with her - hopefully she'll have sense enough to deal with it in the appropriate way.
If you feel confident enough to approach him directly then do so. That may be appreciated more. I was really suggesting a 2nd person approach just in case he reacted badly, and started to argue, and then you at least have a backup person to support you. Whenever I've had to deal with 'issues' with staff that were even slightly contentious - have always had to have a 2nd person to act as witness to the conversations. Litigious world we live in I'm afraid.
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Mochashosh
member
Reged: 16/02/2009
Posts: 276
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You are right Fletch. I don't think he would sue me, but he might be very upset, so I should probably have someone with me if I do have to deal with it.
The trouble is, the person who should probably be dealing with it is as scared as I am. The D of E does not really work in the evening, although I'm sure she knows about the problem, because sadly you could not have met the main and failed to know.
I will have a chat with her and see what she thinks. If she has no better ideas I will do the polyclinic thing, although it may come back to bite me next year, when I start working in the clinic myself.
This one is doubly hard for me because I was accused of being smelly myself some years ago, and I know how hurtful it is.
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MrsSmith
member
Reged: 26/06/2009
Posts: 1436
Loc: Land of milk and honey
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HI Mocha
How horrible that you were accused of being smelly! I know some people do this for whatever reason abnd it must have been awful for you.
Surely the personnel officer should be doing this with the person you told us a about? Or some neutral person?
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Mochashosh
member
Reged: 16/02/2009
Posts: 276
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Mrs Smith, we don't have a personnel officer as such. I'm just worried that someone in the community might say something harsh to him one day.
It is very awful to be told you smell. The only redeeming thing was that it was a boss of mine that told me, and she was absolutely squirming with embarassment. I made it very hard for her and said, "Have you ever smelt me yourself?" and she had to admit that she hadn't. I then went round and did a poll of my team, and none of them had smelt anything either, so I suspect it was a certain woman who was always going on about my weight, and I think assumed that fat people must smell.
On the other hand, maybe I really do honk...
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andfletch
member
Reged: 01/11/2009
Posts: 14
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It's almost funny really (but not quite). We are all fairly good at raising some issues but these really personal ones have us all just stuck in our tracks. I guess the reality is we can all relate on some level, (as you can) and it's about how would I like to be told something like this.
Maybe you and the person who should be dealing with it approach the guy. Poor thing, he does need to know, and coming from 2 people who obviously are trying to help and care enough to stress over it ! would be better than going on wondering why people may be avoiding him. Good Luck whatever you do!
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rosacarol
member
Reged: 16/10/2009
Posts: 369
Loc: Reading
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Would it be possible, rather than to tell the chap that your offended by his smell, but tell him that people have become aware and they are concerned for his health?
You don't say whether it is actually BO or very bad breath. If it's his breath that smells (and you mention a smell like varnish) it could be that he's got diabetes and not realise it. Breath that smells strongly of pear drops, or varnishy, can be a symptom of diabetes and he may not be aware of the smell himself.
I only mention this because exactly this situation arose with a lady I shared an office with. She went to her GP with very smelly breath (which we had drawn to her attention, she had no idea) and it turned out she was diabetic.
Rosa
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ROW
member
Reged: 16/10/2009
Posts: 179
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Hi Mocha, this is really a difficult situation. He must have noticed the effect he has on other people and that must be dreadful for him because he may have no idea at all that he smells, so whoever tells him will be doing a really kind thing.
It is going to be embarrasing for him, whoever tells him really,so who is or isnt in the right position to tell him doesnt really matter.
Perhaps saying something like.... we all care about our students wellbeing and there have been a few comments that you have a strong smell. We want you to be well and happy and that is why I/we are having a quiet word with you about it.
Sadly there is no non-embarrasing way of putting this, there will be an element of embarrassment however you say it..but its the kindest thing to do for him.
Just one thought, I do agree that it would be better to have 2 people there, as its going to have to be said away from anyone else....but both people should do the talking, so both come accross as having his best interests at heart, rather than 1 doing the talking, and one just standing by like a quiet observer.
Try to keep it short and caring so its not a lengthy ordeal for him.
Good luck. Row
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JulieJ
member
Reged: 29/12/2008
Posts: 559
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I wonder whether it would be possible to find out who his GP is? When one joins the classes, do you have to have some kind of emergency number 'just in case' or something like that? If so,then you could phone the GP's surgery, and relay the problem, and ask for it to be raised next time he goes?? (assuming it's something to do with medication of course!)
It really is a horribly sensitive issue, and of course the problem is that if we do smell, we are so used to it we don't notice!
On this 'sensitive' topic I've got another one. Someone has come back to an evening class after a gap of about a year or so - but they've changed gender in the meantime! Now, they were introduced as 'female name' but quite a few long-timers in the class promptly recognised them as having once been 'male name'. So, social dilemma, does one pretend not to recognise them at all, or just be upfront and say 'Hi 'female name', nice to see you back again'.
Any thoughts??!!!!
Julie
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scottishmags
member
Reged: 24/04/2009
Posts: 1327
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Julie, that's an interesting one ..
I think to pretend not to recognise them if it's obviously the same person is a bit false. I'd just talk to them as normal but use their new name. To come back and know you're going to inevitably be the focus of attention takes a lot of courage doesn't it
Mochashosh, good luck with your sensitive situation; I remember a former headteacher of mine having to address the same problem with someone and she said it was the hardest thing she'd ever done. This lady then showered more, but didn't wash her clothes any more frequently, and the problem continued .. so perhaps this guy has never been aware of how often clothes need to be washed either? Difficult one; good luck
Mags
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Paddy53
member
Reged: 24/08/2008
Posts: 81
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Hi all,
The problem with bad smells is difficult - I know that people say you can't smell it yourself, but as someone who does perspire al lot, you can tell! One way is to ask them whether they have noticed a smell, and if they think it is you. Hopefully they will then say "it's not you is it me?"
As far as the gender change is concerned I know someone who had ops to become male - although they had a neutral name - and when I saw them again I just said "great to see you, you are looking fantastic" (they were, and much happier in the new body).
I think that you need to acknowledge it and they shouldn't feel uncomfortable if they are happier now.
P
x
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ROW
member
Reged: 16/10/2009
Posts: 179
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Hi Julie, I would be up front and just say..Hi (female name) good to see you. This person has made their choice in their life and that should be respected. If people ignored her, they would be passing judgement really and nobody has the right to do that.She has shown great courage in coming back to an environment where she was known as a man before and will appreciate the support she gets from people who just accept her for who she now is. Row
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Scarlets
member
Reged: 01/04/2007
Posts: 1889
Loc: Just across the pond
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I had a similar problem to Plasmo
I had employed a lady as secretary to the Head Teacher. I actually knew her and lived not too far from her.
A few weeks later the head called me in and told me that it was my job to tell her she had BO.
Well I refused. Nobody else had complained about it.
I told him that if he was about the only one who had noticed it, then he had to tell her.
I never did find out if he did. She did leave not too long after. Wonder why ! !
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